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JayDeep

In-House production, does it matter?

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JayDeep    1,401

To you, does it mean something to own a watch from a manufacturer where everything is produced in-house? Like Seiko or Rolex?

Or does it not bother you to have a generic movement like ETA or Miyota just like every other watch out there?

Previously I'd never given it much thought, but recently I've been pondering it.

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scottswatches    4,553

Depends on the price of the watch.

My IWC had a lightly modified 7750 movement in it, which I didn't understand back then. These are now a 4k watch,and the movement can be bought for £350. That doesn't feel like value for money.

My Zenith quartz has an ETA 7 jewel movement. But at that price point it is irrelevant, as ETA made some of the best pound for pound quartz movements.

Plus it depends on where the movement is sourced from. Rolex used to use Zenith movements in the Daytona- no problem with that. 

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Daveyboyz    2,387

My Vacheron has a Fredrique Piguet movement in it, I had a look at the thing and its a gorgeous column wheel chronograph movement.   Its not in house like the new ones but it is still very good, the Rolex Daytona's with the Zenith El Primero movements are pretty sought after,  Omega's containing Lemania movements still get some respect and Patek haven't always used in house movements they used to employ movements supplied by Jaegre-Le-Coultre.   Would anyone argue that these are not decent?

Everyone loves to boast in house movements these days and I suspect its generally a good thing, but I think its given a little too much importance by many.  The important thing is the movement is the highest possible quality and this is less about who made it but the lengths they went to in making it.  I the case of the more cheaply produced generic movements people will obviously shrug their shoulders and say "that's no great shakes!"  but the moment could be supplied by another manufacturer in theory and still have people impressed by it like the examples above.  

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relaxer7    3,190

I think that over recent years an in house movement has just been used as another selling/marketing technique. Tudor are the most recent example of this and Joe public lap it up.

Very similar to Omega slapping a healthy premium on for a Co-axial escapement which your average watch buyer has no idea about. They just know it’s more expensive so ‘better’…

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richy176    1,912
1 hour ago, JayDeep said:

To you, does it mean something to own a watch from a manufacturer where everything is produced in-house? Like Seiko or Rolex?

Or does it not bother you to have a generic movement like ETA or Miyota just like every other watch out there?

Previously I'd never given it much thought, but recently I've been pondering it.

When you dig a bit deeper into movements it can get quite complicated as not all in-house movements are fully in-house. Scott mentioned that the early Rolex Daytona used the Zenith El Primero movement and this is also used in one of the Tag Monaco models under the Claibre 36 name. Another Tag Monaco uses the Calibe 11 which is an ETA 2892/2 base with a  Dubois Depraz Chronograph module. If you google Dubois Depraz you will see that they do not make watches but many components which are used by some expensive brands. Well worth a read.

When talking about in-house movements I would not put Seiko and Rolex in the same bracket. If you are buying a £250 Seiko then it may be an in-house movement but very much a mass produced one whereas the Grand Seiko range are a very different kettle of fish and can compete with some of the best Swiss ion-house movements.

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Seikotherapy    1,161

It all depends on why you're buying the watch. I'm saving for a Nomos and one of the selling points is their in-house movement and locally manufactured components. You're buying into the passion and watchmaking rather than just case design and brand, which drives a lot of the 'Swiss made' value imo.

It all comes back to the subjective concept of value (without wanting to open another can of worms) - what one buyer might see as integral to their collection another may not.

For example I would rather spend £300 on a Seiko diver than a (probably less reliable/well-made) Pani homage because it doesn't sit well from a value perspective, but that's just me. Each to his own.

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ong    3,380

I'm a big fan of Rolex watches but not  so sure about some of their movements which were used for years with little technological development.  Recently this has been rectified so I'm talking about pre 2000 Rolex rather than the more recent iterations. 

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WRENCH    8,812

All my Vostoks have an in - house movement, and it matters very much to me. I couldn't suffer it if they contained anything "refined" and less accurate.

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Caller.    2,805

As said above, it depends on the price point. In view of some of the excellent posts above, if I'm paying a few £k for a watch, I want a very good movement, even if that's a heavily modded generic movement.

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mel    1,349

The brit made SMITHS used in house everything except hairsprings - - case, movements, even the boxes were made in house, and instructions and warranties were printed in house. And of course Uncle Olsen's watches were all produced in house for the mechanicals, so it's nothing new. Westclox also, both in US and UK - - :yes:

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RWP    13,844

I'm open minded.......depending on cost.   I have nice seagull movements, ETA, Ronda etc etc

Price sort of dictates what you can expect :yes:

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Velizark0    724

In-house movement and swiss made turn from something very prestige to something that just sell more watches just becouse sounds better and you pay more for it...

If the in-house movement of watch X is created in 6 months, does that mean it is better than my watch Y with some off the shelf movement been used for the past 10 years from 15 different brands...

Unfortunately the modern market is driven by terms like Gross Profit and Growth 

My thoughts :)

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JayDeep    1,401

Yeah I personally don't give a rats tush. I just ask to see if there's any reason I should buy may have missed.

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ZenArcade    312

That all depends, at a certain price point you are paying more for the fit, finish, materials, man hours put into the watch not simply the movement.  It also depends on what you are buying and what you intend to use it for.  You could buy several nice watches and have a regular eye watering service costs coming in or perhaps just one or two in house then enjoy some cheaper stuff on a budget.  Also you have Vostok and Seiko that produce anything from a £50 watch that are technically "in house" so being in house doesn't necessarily mean expensive.

I love the IWC Portuguese but for the price it doesn't really sit well considering what you can get for 4 plus grand.

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In addition to the comments above for in-house movements....I personally value them because they represent the ingenuity and expression of that particular brand and time period. I find the different creative ways in which watchmakers approach the same task absolutely enthralling. I suppose there's only so many ways which you can differentiate an ETA movement in this manner - my 2p 

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Tim F    42

I'd say it's all in the detail. If it's a £4k+ watch with a cheapish movement and little modification then you're better off getting a Hamilton or Tissot with ETA for £3000 thousands less. Cases can be expensive but I find it difficult to believe some of the cases are worth thousands of pounds. TAG / Breitling / IWC (ETA ones) make me nervous value-wise. 

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